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I play for team terrible...
cloverstorm
#1 Posted : 8/2/2010 10:19:37 AM(UTC)
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Here you can discuss the following videos.
Click link below to open video player in pop-up window.

I play for team terrible... Part 1/2
I play for team terrible... Part 2/2

NLHE $22 336 Player Tourney.

Another aggravating finish to a cash run in a tourney.
connectorz
#2 Posted : 8/2/2010 12:46:36 PM(UTC)
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cloverstorm wrote:


Another aggravating finish to a cash run in a tourney.


I assume that its aggravating because you made such an erratic shove. I think its safe to say that you are no in auto shove A6 mode, even if it is utg 5handed.

You have 21bb or M=10. There is no REAL rush to start getting it in. To be clear, I don't oppose you open shoving 21bb. Its just that the spots where you can do this are pretty limited, blind v blind with small pairs and hands like A9 for example. Raise folding here is not out of the question. I would far prefer to see you make it like 2.3k and fold to a shove from the bb than openshove a6. I also would prefer to see you just fold A6 here. Reason being you are not deep stacked, and A6 is a hand with reverse implied odds. The times you get called and flop that ace, if your opponent has one also, you are getting stacked practically 100% of the time, obviously this doesn't matter with your openshoving strategy, but I'm just saying if you took the first line, and as a result played A6 posftlop, this would be the situation.

You shoved 21k to win 2.1k, 10% added onto your stack. Not worth it imo when you know that everytime you get called, by anyone, you are going to be dominated really. I think its wishful thinking to want either of the blinds/button to call off with KQ or 33 etc. There is one shorty, out of the blinds who might call you lighter than A6, but even then, I think its slightly wishful thinking.

If you watch this back, you might change your mind with regards to A6 being a 'must shove' there, but if you don't I suggest you look at your shoving range with regards to stack size, because this is not a +ev shove.

Not saying you played badly, I just think that the shove was a poor one.


lg
#4 Posted : 8/2/2010 3:23:45 PM(UTC)
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You should have shoved K8 on the button and Q5 vs the blind but to shove 9Ts utg and A6o from mid is not a winning play. Also I think shoving all the time isn't gonna get you far. Just make it 2.2 - 2.5 the bb and see what the other ppl do and then make your decision. Esp. when you have big hands you will get more money that way!
cloverstorm
#3 Posted : 8/2/2010 5:09:16 PM(UTC)
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connectorz wrote:
cloverstorm wrote:


Another aggravating finish to a cash run in a tourney.


I assume that its aggravating because you made such an erratic shove. I think its safe to say that you are no in auto shove A6 mode, even if it is utg 5handed.

You have 21bb or M=10. There is no REAL rush to start getting it in. To be clear, I don't oppose you open shoving 21bb. Its just that the spots where you can do this are pretty limited, blind v blind with small pairs and hands like A9 for example. Raise folding here is not out of the question. I would far prefer to see you make it like 2.3k and fold to a shove from the bb than openshove a6. I also would prefer to see you just fold A6 here. Reason being you are not deep stacked, and A6 is a hand with reverse implied odds. The times you get called and flop that ace, if your opponent has one also, you are getting stacked practically 100% of the time, obviously this doesn't matter with your openshoving strategy, but I'm just saying if you took the first line, and as a result played A6 posftlop, this would be the situation.

You shoved 21k to win 2.1k, 10% added onto your stack. Not worth it imo when you know that everytime you get called, by anyone, you are going to be dominated really. I think its wishful thinking to want either of the blinds/button to call off with KQ or 33 etc. There is one shorty, out of the blinds who might call you lighter than A6, but even then, I think its slightly wishful thinking.

If you watch this back, you might change your mind with regards to A6 being a 'must shove' there, but if you don't I suggest you look at your shoving range with regards to stack size, because this is not a +ev shove.

Not saying you played badly, I just think that the shove was a poor one.




Yeah I really need to start reading and understanding these kind of things. I thought for some reason my M was lower than 10, I thought it was around 7(Off top of my head) and that is shove first. It was aggravating because I use to play the A6 differently but misunderstood a lot of things I read and thought I needed to shove first with an Ace 5 handed with only 20bb.

Should I have shoved the 9Tdd hand? I had a 7 M on 400/800 100 ante blinds.

edit: thanks for the input
cloverstorm
#5 Posted : 8/2/2010 6:42:38 PM(UTC)
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Also is it ever ok to NOT play the A6 here?
JayJSmith
#6 Posted : 8/2/2010 7:02:49 PM(UTC)
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cloverstorm wrote:
Also is it ever ok to NOT play the A6 here?


Of course it is. I mean... I haven't actually even watched the video. But if your aim is merely to climb the pay ladder as much as possible, then it's perfectly fine to be folding any hand you don't want to be getting it in with from mid-position. Obviously, if you are aiming to win then you should be raising the hand... not shoving... but raising is fine, since you can't fold your way to first... but if you're 'hanging on' for a while... then folding is perfectly acceptable here.
dabeear
#7 Posted : 8/2/2010 8:17:46 PM(UTC)
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Hey Clover- Not seen the vid properly but cudn't resit comentating about A6 - Connectorz covers it off pretty well but i would advocate just folding that pile of trash tbh ! Its such a hand that can been creamed soo easily its just not worth it. I'd rather see you shuv with 89 suited thatn A6o.......

As for the shuvn side of things again i have to agree with connectorz(can't believe I'm saying that - must be the magic mushrooms !!) but 22 BB is not shuv territory. Now and again with a top hand to confuse people(ie good pair) I might say ok for tricky play but not with trash. 2.5 BB raise and hopefully with position OUTPLAY your opponent post flop is much better. If you get played back at you can run away and your still in the tourny. U shuv and get called how ofter is A6 gonna hold up....... almost zero its that bad.

So in summary with 22 BB u don't need to gamble - Chill out, have a cadburys caramel, and let the Tuna do the flapping - Pick your spots and pick your hands and DUMP A6 !!

BigGrin
mjk
#8 Posted : 8/2/2010 8:23:55 PM(UTC)
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since when has jamming 20 BB become standard? You still have a stack size where you can raise fold. 20 BB stacks are good for re-shoving over standard opens, but open shoving 20 BB is excessive... Plus, its obvious you have a weak hand because I can guarantee you would not have jammed that 21x stack with AA or KK. Even players at this level will notice things like that and call with hands like A10 AJ or middle pocket pairs.
connectorz
#9 Posted : 8/2/2010 11:44:50 PM(UTC)
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I think he gets the point about A6 now boyos.

Haley
#10 Posted : 8/3/2010 7:22:49 AM(UTC)
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Pokertube in a nutshell..

losing players making strategy vids
BigGrin
mjk
#12 Posted : 8/3/2010 8:52:57 AM(UTC)
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Haley wrote:
Pokertube in a nutshell..

losing players making strategy vids
BigGrin


Its not a strategy vid, he recorded his session and is asking for advice. Pokertube "in a nutshell" is a community of aspiring poker players helping each other get better. Ok, bye.
connectorz
#11 Posted : 8/3/2010 10:32:39 AM(UTC)
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Haley wrote:
Pokertube in a nutshell..

losing players making strategy vids
BigGrin


Who are you? Oh, Nobody. K thnx bye.
1 user thanked connectorz for this useful post.
Fitzy on 8/3/2010(UTC)
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