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should i have raised more on the flop?
jacki183
#1 Posted : 12/22/2011 9:28:16 AM(UTC)
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should i have raised more on the flop?
Brisvegan
#2 Posted : 12/22/2011 11:26:58 AM(UTC)
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He's almost certainly not folding on the flop with Kings. My thought is that, based on your flat pre-flop he probably puts you on a mid-sized pair or suited cards, and your min-raise as not believing his c-bet. He flats, hoping no heart comes, and jams it.

I don't think at the $3 level he's going away.
karpov42
#4 Posted : 12/22/2011 1:04:26 PM(UTC)
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There is a bad beat section. So you don't have to "disguise" your bad beat posts as question.
Are you posting this if the K comes on flop?

HE should have raised more pre since there were so many flattards at the table who are flatting with stacksizes....... - laughable.
BixBax
#5 Posted : 12/22/2011 10:11:45 PM(UTC)
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Why are you asking about your flop action? Are you thinking that maybe you should have raised more to protect your trips, since the hand ended up with him hitting a one outer? That's result oriented and generally you shouldn't worry about protecting against one or two out draws. Besides the raise size you chose was good enough to pot commit anyone who calls, so you got optimal value.

What is much more interesting is your preflop action. I realize that you get somewhat decent pot odds to over call the 3-bet, but I would be extremely worried about the reverse implied odds with this particular hand. You are not flopping monsters AND getting paid often enough to make the risk/reward math even out.
TheDawg08
#6 Posted : 12/22/2011 10:35:23 PM(UTC)
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Like the guy is folding KK in a 3$ tournament with no A on board. LOL Get real. Even with an A they're still going all in cuz they can't wrap their heads around folding KK.
B33rT0k3n5
#7 Posted : 12/22/2011 10:50:07 PM(UTC)
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I agree-post flop he isnt folding to your min re raise as it does look weak....and because the ace hasnt come he wont fold at them buy ins 9/10.

Its preflop id be worried about-nothing wrong with your initial call-but when theres more callers after you and a 3 bet-you need to be re evaluationg your starting hand espewcially with the players to act after you also.

Chances are he isnt 3 betting into that many people with anything that either has you completely crushed or dominated at l;east.

Put it down to unluckyness for him hitting the two outer but perhaps learn to be tighter preflop in certain situations.
jwelbourne
#3 Posted : 12/23/2011 5:48:52 AM(UTC)
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Doesn't matter what you do there not going to be a fold ever in that spot.
Save your self some chips and fold to the 3 bet pre
jacki183
#8 Posted : 12/23/2011 9:40:55 PM(UTC)
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thanks guys, i appreciate the advice.
Joobs
#9 Posted : 12/23/2011 10:52:49 PM(UTC)
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The other guys have already said it, fold pre to the 3bet, but I just wanna touch on your min+raise. I really disagree with Beertoken that it looks weak. I think it looks really, really strong. I mean on a QQ3 board what else are you small raising there? You never do it with a flushdraw, you're either gonna jam as you have fold equity or just flat as it's fairly cheap. Are you likely to be stepping out here with air in a 5 way 3bet pot when you have the 3better cbetting (albeit weakly) and 2 players left to act behind you (one of which's jam you would virtually have to call regardless of your holding). Not to mention the fact that you're still nearly 150bb deep so it'd be a weird to decide to spew here. I don't really need to mention why raising with a pocket pair would be terrible. Needlessly bloating the pot/only getting value from better hands yada yada yada. I'm pretty confident you're never making a weird 'find out where you are' raise with a PP here either (I really hope not). I guess the people you're playing against might, so there is some value to it but in my mind you basically have to have a Q here every single time (or 33). I mean it doesn't matter too much here, people don't fold overpairs, but I much prefer flatting to cbet or jamming to make it look like a FD. If he's calling your small raise he's gonna call a jam. Flatting keeps draws/smaller pairs in your range and potentially lets one of the other 2 behind you to spew, and you can still easily gets stacks in on the river. It kinda sucks when one of the 2 behind overcalls with a FD and gets there, but that happens a very small % of time and you still have redraws when it does.
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